tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post8326810931595261268..comments2023-06-29T06:19:46.900-07:00Comments on Family Ties: Can we please stop the "real parents" adoption debates?Susan P.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-41725426555533145662013-02-14T10:27:16.314-08:002013-02-14T10:27:16.314-08:00Lori, thanks for commenting and for linking to you...Lori, thanks for commenting and for linking to your article. Loved what you said there, and hope many are open to hearing it.Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-75741146842078850832013-02-13T11:27:26.781-08:002013-02-13T11:27:26.781-08:00That article made me very sad for Marianne and for...That article made me very sad for Marianne and for any other adoptee who is expected to rank their sets of (very real) parents. The split that the "who is real" question causes is tragic in its effect and in the fact that it's just plain unnecessary to ask.<br /><br />I guest posted an article around this topic a couple of months ago. <br /><br />"Neither answer is right or wrong. What’s wrong is asking the question in the first place. (Often, it’s not the parents asking; rather it’s society-at-large wanting a definitive answer to the age-old question of Nature vs Nurture)."<br /><br />http://www.creatingafamily.org/blog/adoption-domestic-adoption-international-adoption-embryo-adoption-foster-care-adoption/real-adoption-splits-babies/Lori Lavender Luzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15394441222262940632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-86304436350162721512013-01-26T20:37:18.227-08:002013-01-26T20:37:18.227-08:00it sounds like we had similar experiences.. hang i...it sounds like we had similar experiences.. hang in there. <3<br /><br />I hate reading posts that imply we are unworthy too. it cuts me so deeply..Raehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02699992830085462792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-36828604462412537512013-01-24T11:27:04.340-08:002013-01-24T11:27:04.340-08:00Maureen, thanks for commenting -- and I'm so g...Maureen, thanks for commenting -- and I'm so glad this post is making the rounds! I do what I can to get my posts out there, but I'm not very technologically proficient! The internet is a wonderful thing for the adoption reform movement.Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-67982636541159567392013-01-24T11:24:30.140-08:002013-01-24T11:24:30.140-08:00Thanks for the encouragement, Lorraine! I would f...Thanks for the encouragement, Lorraine! I would feel better if I could get more of my writing into the mainstream press, but as you know, placing stories about the complexities of adoption is extremely difficult. Thank goodness for blogging!Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-58980419525298786092013-01-24T09:57:26.227-08:002013-01-24T09:57:26.227-08:00Wonderful, valuable post. Thank you. The link reac...Wonderful, valuable post. Thank you. The link reached me (an adoptive parent) via Adopted and Fostered Adults of the African Diaspora, Harlow's Monkey, Lisa Marie Rollins, and the Minnesota Adoption Resource Network. I of course shared the link on my FB page and a dear friend (and grandma like me) in North Dakota shared the link as well. Just wanted to let you know word is getting out lol. Again, thank you. Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16134400664440786394noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-10783321489608381582013-01-24T07:54:47.625-08:002013-01-24T07:54:47.625-08:00Great post, because it touches upon the issue that...Great post, because it touches upon the issue that keeps original birth records sealed: the sense that adopted cannot search without hurting their other parents, the ones who raised them. If there was a way to stamp out this idea in our culture I would do it! But because adoptees feel--I don't know what word to use here, the one that comes to mind is "squashed" mentally when they think about their natural parents--er, intimidated for lots of reasons, our push for reform to give all people the right to know who they are remains stymied. Articles such as the one that Marianna wrote keep the adopted in the mental chains of adoption. <br /><br />Keep on truckin', lady, you've got a lot to say that needs to be heard. <br />Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-14862099859406246352013-01-24T07:05:21.156-08:002013-01-24T07:05:21.156-08:00Thanks for commenting, Julie. I hope that as an a...Thanks for commenting, Julie. I hope that as an adoptive mother, you will share your eloquent voice with the power brokers in adoption who work so hard to keep adoptees' birth records sealed. Adults must be free to navigate their own relationships. Such a simple concept, yet fighting for adult adoptee access on the legislative level is like fighting World War III.Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-72690959603621253062013-01-24T06:45:57.662-08:002013-01-24T06:45:57.662-08:00As the adoptive mother of five now-adult daughters...As the adoptive mother of five now-adult daughters, I think the most important part of what you have to say is that things change. Opinions change. Life changes. And in adoption, that cuts in every direction. My daughter's bio parents had their rights terminated, all for very good reasons. But by age 21, every one of the kids were in contact with their bio-natural-real-call it what you will families. None of the reunions were static and my daughters' opinions have shifted from "Get out of my Life" to sympathy to anger to "I don't care to be around you" to empathy. I wouldn't hold Marianna to how she feels today. As has already been pointed out, having children may change her feelings. Just getting older may change her feelings--it's shocking to me that I am just now (I'm in my sixties) getting into that "old lady" hobby of geneology.<br /><br />The real point, of course, is that as our feelings change, we need to have the freedom to find out our relationships, something closed adoption records impede without good cause.Julienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-56892056622556375462013-01-23T18:09:43.328-08:002013-01-23T18:09:43.328-08:00Thanks for writing this, Susan P!
I am very conc...Thanks for writing this, Susan P! <br /><br />I am very concerned about the sheer ignorance of the general public. It is as if we - the adoption reform movement - have not been heard - ever! All the hard work since the 70s and before that, Jean Paton and Orphan Voyage since 1953. Why are not the major books of the movement made mandatory reading by people who want to adopt? <br /><br />The same arguments over and over again. "Who are your real parents?"<br /><br />"Well, I'm sorry that YOU are confused! I'm not! I have two mothers and two fathers and YOU can't accept the facts. Your lack of understanding adoption is not my problem. Just don't let your uniformed opinions prevent me from: having a relationship with my natural mother and father if we agree to it, and, obtaining a certified copy of my true birth certificate. Since my sealed birth certificate states the facts of my birth, perhaps that is the key for YOU to understand: one sperm meets one egg and the MOTHER gestates the pregnancy leading to the birth of HER baby. What grade did we learn basic biology? 3rd grade? What part of reality do you not understand?" <br /><br />Sorry Susan. Obviously I'm talking to the people who dictate over our rights.<br /><br /> halforphan56https://www.blogger.com/profile/15993703627790425846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-25947841530999289252013-01-22T04:54:54.348-08:002013-01-22T04:54:54.348-08:00Thanks for commenting, freeborn! I hope that more...Thanks for commenting, freeborn! I hope that more and more people affected by adoption will join the on-line chorus, and that we can get these archaic laws changed during my lifetime!Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-60593131138096555002013-01-21T21:13:48.833-08:002013-01-21T21:13:48.833-08:00I love this!I love this!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-75760437975797081112013-01-21T13:49:08.203-08:002013-01-21T13:49:08.203-08:00I think part of the trouble is that some adoptive ...I think part of the trouble is that some adoptive parents have been prepared so poorly for the lifetime realities of adoption. From what I have seen, the attorneys who facilitate adoptions go out of their way to assure adoptive parents that the original parents won't be a "problem." The whole mindset needs to change, and I think in many circles it is changing. But it is an uphill battle because there is money in adoption, and the enterprise is very loosely regulated. Glad you have reconnected with your son, and sorry that his adoptive family can't see that as an asset rather than a threat. Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-55532461936706361462013-01-20T17:38:24.446-08:002013-01-20T17:38:24.446-08:00To my son's adoptive family I ceased to exist ...To my son's adoptive family I ceased to exist the day he was adopted and they have punished him for his relationship with me. <br /><br />I have a wonderful relationship with him, his wife and kids much to the chagrin of his adoptive family! We talk almost ever day. He "found" me when he was 23 but deferred because of his adoptive father. When his father passed, my son pursued finding me and we connected 17 years later. <br /><br />I know we are one of the lucky reunions. Of course, there have been ups and downs but let me be clear the issues have been ONLY because of his adoptive family. I am sorely disappointed in them as human beings. They are the losers as I came into this with an open mind and heart.Angellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02400662014485775139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-52910605096094285552013-01-19T09:45:45.565-08:002013-01-19T09:45:45.565-08:00Yes, and what is sad is that what Marianna says is...Yes, and what is sad is that what Marianna says is what many adoptive parents want to hear. There is still so much denial at work in so many aspects of adoption.Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-32800252896427805342013-01-19T08:45:42.313-08:002013-01-19T08:45:42.313-08:00I didn't post this on the article itself becau...I didn't post this on the article itself because so many HuffPo commenters are completely and utterly psycho, but I hear more than fear in Marianna's voice. I hear racism and self-loathing. I think she's really, REALLY invested in being a little suburban white girl (this piece ran in a Chicago paper back in November, and I was shocked to learn that Marianna, who goes to great effort to come across like a 14 year old Valley Girl, is actually a 20-something adult)--and I doubt she can even stand to think about her original family in Chile. I think the idea of coming face to face with who she really is is more than she can take.Renee Musgrovehttp://alwaysrenee.typepad.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-36720019352981521522013-01-18T07:40:58.176-08:002013-01-18T07:40:58.176-08:00Whose to say if this girl Marianna is even real. T...Whose to say if this girl Marianna is even real. That series was started by an adoptive mother and I find it bias. But if she is a real adoptee, who knows what she was told about her real mother by the adoptive parents. I think there are many out there that tell adoptees outright lies to scare them into never wanting to search or to make them like them better. I also think it is up to the adoptee TO DECIDE who are the real parents. Me, personally, I always knew that the people who conceived me ARE my real parents. Because what IS a parent? What has a parent been since the beginning of time? A parent is someone who lets you know who else you are related to along with being responsible for your birth. And adoptive parents can DO NEITHER. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-26412320426530254012013-01-17T18:16:11.912-08:002013-01-17T18:16:11.912-08:00There is still so much ignorance about the complex...There is still so much ignorance about the complexities of adoption, the real human beings involved, and the way that some adoption facilitators mislead people -- I am so sorry you have been treated this way. Sealed records have caused so much damage and continue to do so. I'm just glad that more and more people are speaking out and that the internet is amplifying their voices. Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-15434290065430764772013-01-17T17:17:59.094-08:002013-01-17T17:17:59.094-08:00I can't tell you how hurtful, now disheartenin...I can't tell you how hurtful, now disheartening and numb it makes one feel to hear people say they think so little of the woman and family who lose and have suffered so while others gain from that suffering and loss. This has happened to me personally; being treated as nothing more than a broodmare, incubator for my son's "perfect wonderful" adopters. They are far from perfect. Selfish liars are more like it. I am no incubator. I am a mother who made a detrimental mistake that altered the course of my life. <br /><br />Before the adoption, women are so wonderful, so selfless and worthy of so much respect and admiration. After the adoption, she is demonized and degraded to the point where she is not even spoken of as a human being. Some of those comments I have read on Yahoo in regards to mothers and their children being reunited are absolutely astounding. The coldness, the hatefulness and entitlement is just sickening. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-72126532228891625532013-01-17T15:55:41.871-08:002013-01-17T15:55:41.871-08:00The counterpoint is a great idea! And this senten...The counterpoint is a great idea! And this sentence is so great, Robin. "Also, because of sealed records, searching seems like it is illegal or at least immoral when it is the LAW telling you that you cannot have this information. When you combine that with what you are told by your APs (we're your REAL parents), it can be very hard to get out from under that mindset." Isn't that the truth? That's why we have to change the archaic law. Always appreciate your comments.Susan P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00349497879874393200noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8112566410387491537.post-18421435586882793192013-01-17T15:35:44.894-08:002013-01-17T15:35:44.894-08:00I think many people at that age do not understand ...I think many people at that age do not understand the full scope of what adoption means in their lives. Growing up adopted, the loss of genetic connections is the norm. Many don't quite understand that they carry the genes of people who came before them in history and how important ancestry and especially (as you found out) one's medical history is.<br /><br />I think they should also do a counterpoint with someone older who holds an an opposing view. Also, because of sealed records, searching seems like it is illegal or at least immoral when it is the LAW telling you that you cannot have this information. When you combine that with what you are told by your APs (we're your 'REAL' parents), it can be very hard to get out from under that mindset.<br /><br />I also hear fear in Marianna's words. Not just fear of hurting her APs but fear of abandonment by them and/or rejection from her first parents.<br /><br />It wouldn't surprise me in the least if one day she eats her words.<br /><br />Great post as always, Susan.Robinnoreply@blogger.com